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My Rockwell 14 X 40 Lathe

Discussion in 'ROCKWELL & DELTA & AAMCO MANUFACTURING CO.' started by 4gsr, Oct 16, 2015.

  1. jjtgrinder

    jjtgrinder JJTGRINDER H-M Supporter-Premium

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    NO, Your machine is a new model with a brake. The machines built in the 60's did not have the brake and it could not be added as an option. That's what I was implying. I do not know anything about the brakes because mine doesn't have one. My machine will stop in about 12 seconds. I plan to implement an "electronic" brake in the future with the VFD.
     
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  2. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I was able to get a pitch diameter measurement off of the thread on the back end of the spindle yesterday. It measured at 1.702". Working backwards, I determined the thread is a 1.750-16 UN RH thread. Probably a class 2A since the PD dimension is at the bottom of the tolerance for the external thread. Just so happens I have a tap for the same thread that makes a handy gage and a way for me to size the nut without going oversize on the PD. Thread bore for this thread is 1.682/1.696". These measurements confirm with John's measurements in the previous post for the thread size. Now, all I have to do is make a nut. I'm thinking about making it long enough for mounting a small chuck or "cat head" device for supporting long shafts or tubes.

    Ken

    PS. Still waiting on the 20" L & S lathe to disappear from my garage so I can get this off the trailer in it's place.
     
    Last edited: Dec 20, 2015
  3. junk iron

    junk iron United States Active Member Active Member

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    Hey fellows I picked up one of these 14 in lathe,it's leaking a little oil around shaft where you put it in back gear,saw the parts manual that is posted in this thread and it looks lik o ring,anyone ever replaced this o ring? Thanks
     
  4. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Nope.
    I will be pulling mine soon to fix the worm gear, put it back in position to engage the gear on the eccentric that engages the back gear. On my lathe, the back gear was disabled where it could not be used by someone in the past before I bought mine. It appears to be an easy removal of the shaft to replace the O-Ring. You may have to remove the roll pin holding the sleeve on the shaft as well as any other pins yours may have in place.

    If you haven't already done so, visit the Rockwell Lathe group on Yahoo grooups for lots of information posted there.

    www.yahoo.com/neo/groups/RockwellLathe/conversations/messages

    (The link above is not working for me, can't figure it out either)

    Note: You will have to drain the oil out of the headstock to do this repair, unless you want about two gallons of oil to pour out on everything!

    Ken
     
  5. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    For anyone who might be interested in what the inside of the headstock looks like on a 14" Rockwell lathe. As I mentioned above, someone disabled the back gear on my lathe long before I bought it. I have a stray gear that looks like it came from the headstock, so I figured it was toast and would never have a back gear for use when needed.
    Well, once I opened up the headstock and saw what was going on, I think I'm in better shape than I first thought. That gear was replaced with a new replacement, but they put a spacer in behind the gear to always keep it in gear. They removed the pawl or shoe that rode in the groove of the gear that engaged it for back gear. I will have to make a new one when I get a chance. The other thing they did was re-position the worm on the shaft where it would not engage the worm gear on the back gear, which is used to engage the back gear with the spindle bull gear. I hope this can be fixed with out too much difficulty. Other than that, the headstock looks nice on the inside! Oh, I did get the spindle take up nut drawn up ready to make and mount. I'll post an picture when I get it done. Ken
     

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  6. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Finally got the retainer nut made that goes on the back end of the spindle. This is to replace the original nut removed by the person that stole the collet attachment off this lathe before I bought it. Next is to get it mounted on the spindle. Try to get that done tomorrow.
     

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  7. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Mounted the retainer nut on the lathe today. Can't wait to mount a chuck on it now!
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Sep 11, 2016
  8. junk iron

    junk iron United States Active Member Active Member

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    thanks for the help gsr
     
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  9. kspainhour

    kspainhour United States Iron Registered Member

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    Ken,
    Do you know happen to know what the "shoe for dog clutch" part that is missing in your lathe looks like? It would be the part on the end of the shaft to move the gear to engage the direct drive. It is number 33 in the parts list. Part mumber 414-03-047-5002. The reason I ask is I have a similar issue. The one I have looks like it was shop made and it doesn't work exactly right.

    Thanks,
    Keith
     
  10. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Keith,

    That's the part I'm missing on my lathe, too.
    As soon as I can get one drawn up and made, I'll be glad to share it with you. Don't hold your breath! It maybe several months before I get it done. I have a full plate right now of work I have to get done before the first of the year. If I have break during this time, I'll try to do something.

    Ken
     
  11. kspainhour

    kspainhour United States Iron Registered Member

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    Thanks Ken,
    I may have one! I had a chance to work on the lathe this evening and I found this in the cabinet



    20161007_170842.jpg


    Looks like the previous owners made something that looks like a "c" to replace it and threw this in the cabinet with some other parts.
    It looks worn on the sides and the diameter of the pin is somewhere around .360. The hole in the shaft in this lathe measures .376.

    Take Care,
    Keith
     
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  12. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    That's exactly what I envision it looking like. I haven't measured the width of the groove in the gear, but I'm guessing it to be around 1/2". The sliding gear in mine was replaced. I have the old gear sitting here on my book shelf. The groove is in bad shape and the clutch dogs that engages the mating clutch are rounded off.
    I'm working on getting it running right now. Fixing to go out and work on the motor wiring today. Have some wires not connected correctly. Wire numbers are not very clear on the motor. Motor barely runs at very low RPM before it blows the heaters on the starter.
    Thanks for posting the picture, helps a lot. Ken
     
  13. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I've started tearing into the Rockwell last month. What a nasty mess! Lots of cleaning and when you think you got it all, find something else that needs cleaning. As you can see from the pictures, I've removed the clutch-brake assembly for cleaning. Got the lower cabinet cleaned about as good as it is going to get. Cleaned up the clutch-brake shaft assembly and found a socket head cap screw that had backed off and was bent. Pulled it all apart, cleaned, re-assembled, added some blue Loctite to the screws and made up.
     

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  14. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    After I got things assembled, couldn't figure out why there was a gap where the brake pad is supposed to bear against the angle plate. Turns out the angle plate is not square to the brake pad. So a little shimming here and there fixed that problem. You can see a wear pattern on the angle plate where it has been like that ever since the lathe left the factory. Last picture showing the drive train re-assembled. Ken
     

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  15. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    With the last few pictures showing the back gear clutch and clutch piece that came off of the spindle.
    I'm looking at putting four notches on the two pieces instead of two notches. It will require making a new clutch that gos on the spindle and modifying the gear by adding a weld build up to machine into clutch teeth. Last thing will be making a new grooved ring that is shown on the opposite end from the clutch teeth on the gear. This is where the dog rides in that groove and does the engaging in-out of the clutch. Any offers on doing some tig welding?
    Last, will be the making of the dog. Ken
     

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  16. kspainhour

    kspainhour United States Iron Registered Member

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    Looking forward to seeing the repair. Thanks for posting pictures.

    Take Care,
    Keith
     
  17. Silverbullet

    Silverbullet Active Member Active Member

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    Even tho it needed work it looks like a well made LATHE. There's been a few of those near me on cl, not sure there 14" but nice looking . There's a Rockwell near me for $900.00 another for double that but doesn't look near as good.
    Lots of nice machines around me but all I can do is look . But it keeps me doing something.
    Anybody on here who might like me help find a machine I'd be glad too. Being stuck inside in a hospital bed ain't like I got anything else I can do.
     
  18. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    I've been working on getting the parts needing fixing for the headstock on my 14" Rockwell lathe. Finally got someone to do the weld build up I needed for one of the parts. The welding came out decent for this rebuild. Next, had to get all the things machined, that has taken time to get done. Slowly but surely, I'm getting there. I have two more things to make for the headstock assembly as well as waiting on another bearing and oil seal. Those are last things going on the headstock which won't be an issue. Ken

    Here are some pictures of the repairs and new ones made.
    • [​IMG]

    • Here's a picture of the sliding gear with the clutch face cut on it. Original setup had only two clutch notches to the design. I changed it to four clutch faces. Part of the reason for doing this is to gain more bearing face for driving the clutch without kicking out of gear. The face angle was changed from about 10 degree to 15 degrees to give it a little bit more frictional grip to keep it from jumping out of gear. Of course the laws of friction say the angle needs to be at least 19 degrees, well my next dovetail cutter is 30 degrees and I wasn't about to grind one for 20 degrees.
    • [​IMG]

    • [​IMG]
      Here's my setup to mill the keyways.-Don't ask me why I took off the two piece jaws off of the master jaws. I won't tell you.

    • [​IMG]

    • Not sure why I took this picture
    • [​IMG]

    • Milling the keyways on the spindle-B.T.W. the Rockwell Lathe spindle on the 14" Lathe is not that hard. Say in the 28-36 HRC range. The tapered nose of the spindle may be in the mid to high 40's, not 58-62 HRC as seen on most lathe spindles
    • [​IMG]
      Here is the fit up of the keys to the clutch ring and spindle. My broach man did a nice job broaching the keyways and getting them 90 degrees apart.

    • [​IMG]
      Here are the finished parts

    • [​IMG]
      A view of the clutch ring mating up to the clutch on the sliding gear

    • [​IMG]
      A top view of the parts
     

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    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
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  19. 4gsr

    4gsr Global Moderator Staff Member H-M Supporter-Premium

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    Was able to get a start on putting the guts back in the headstock. Re-installed the back gear shaft assembly. Went back easier than it did coming out. First thing you do is install the eccentric sleeve into the headstock without the guts added. There is a dog point set screw on the back side of the headstock that needs to go into the groove on the eccentric sleeve. Leave it loose, adjusting this will come later. Next, drop the bull gear assy into position and start back gear shaft into the bore of the bull gear. To help get the shaft started, stick a short piece of rod about 2" long in the small end of the shaft, so you have a way to pick that end up to align into the bearing bore in the eccentric bushing.
    Also pay attention to the witness mark on the end of the shaft. It needs to be on top dead center when installing, so you know where all the woodruff keys will be on top. (It's not on top dead center in my picture) This also lines up the tapered pin hole for installing the taper pin. Once the bull gear is in place and pinned, go to the other end and install the pinion gear on end of the shaft. Then install the washer and bolt.

    DSCN3647.JPG
    And why Rockwell didn't drill and tap the end of the shaft for easy removal, I don't know. If anyone ever has to remove the back gear shaft assembly for any reason, I highly recommend drilling and tapping the end of the shaft for something like 3/8-16 unc thread. If the No. 5 taper pin was ever sheared off, this is almost the only way your going to get it apart.
    DSCN3648.JPG
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017

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